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BobbyDouglas
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/20/2004 15:32:35
Helge-
I was wondering how long it took you to make a few of those flash movies.
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vrphoto8
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/26/2004 15:47:29
As a 0-360 user with the Canon G5, I also must speak up to defend the 0-360.
IgotDreams, you mention you were shooting in Manual mode, and using the 'default' 1/125 exposure time. First of all, the directions for the 0-360 say to shoot in aperature priority mode, not manual. Why were you using manual mode?
Second, THERE IS NO DEFAULT EXPOSURE TIME IN MANUAL MODE!. Manual mode is just that: Manual. The camera expects you to set the aperature and the exposure time. If you were shooting the dark room at the same exposure you were shooting outdoors, no wonder your indoor photos were too dark. In manual mode, you have to set the exposure for every shot, based on the lighting conditions. Manual is a way for the photographer to override the camera's metered exposure. You overrode it, and made the pix way too dark.
The directions for the 0-360 for the G5 say to use aperature priority mode, which is a great feature. You set the aperature to F8.0, and the camera AUTOMATICALLY adjusts the exposure time depending on the lighting of the room.
Use aperature priority, and you will get great results!
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Nigel
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/26/2004 17:18:46
I have to disagree with vrphoto8 based on the gallery shots at 0-360's own website.
These shots we're taken with a variety of good quality cameras - Nikon, Fuji, Canon & Sony. EVERY indoor shot has blown out windows which confirms the view held by myself and others that these systems are Ok for outdoor shots but are not suitable for quality indoor virtual tours.
In my opinion if your showing a virtual tour of a property you can't ignore the view from the window - it's too important.
I do however, recognise that this market is quite diverse and there does appear to be a place for cheap real estate tours.
From a professional point of view I'd be interested to see any indoor samples you can show us where the system has coped with windows on a bright day.
Nigel
< Message edited by Nigel -- 4/26/2004 17:19:22 >
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vrphoto8
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/26/2004 18:55:18
Nigel,
Blown-out windows are not caused by the lens, but by the camera. Current digital cameras cannot capture bright windows and dark rooms at the same time. If you take 20 pictures and stitch them together, you can work around this issue, as you are basically taking a mosaic of photos, all at different exposures, and pasting them together. But when taking the room with one shot, the windows and walls are exposed the same. So you will either get a nice room with blown out windows, or be able to see out the windows but have a dark room. This is true with all 360 degree panos, not just those from the 0-360.
One trick to use with the 0-360 is to take a bracketed exposure (3 shots at once, darker, medium, lighter) and composite them using software. This greatly increases the dynamic range of the camera (reducing glare, picking up detail in the shadows), and has a side benefit of reducing that digital camera background noise.
Of course, there is not substitute for good lighting in the room.
-Jimmy
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vrphoto8
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/26/2004 19:08:00
Nigel,
I just visited your site. Your panos have blown-out windows as well. This proves my point, that it is a problem with digital cameras, and not the lens.
You recommended photomatix to the thread. Have you tried it? I saw some results with the 0-360 and photomatix, and the blown-out windows were gone! The images were beautiful.
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BobbyDouglas
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/28/2004 22:25:58
Guess they suckered someone else in. I love this lens!
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Nigel
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/29/2004 8:26:07
Igotdreams,
Are you suggesting that Jimmy (vrpohto8) is connected with 0-360??
I'm not a great lover of ipix either but that's another story. To the best of my knowledge ipix don't make lenses but they will sell you a kit which contains a lens manufactured elswhere.
Nigel
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vrphoto8
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/29/2004 10:54:33
quote:
ORIGINAL: IgotDreams
lets just face it, the one shot systems are CRAP. There is nothing more than I want in this world, but for them to work, believe me.
Not true. Read the manual, and they work great!
quote:
Jimmy, I know how to work my camera.
Sure you do... That's why you are shooting in manual mode without changing the exposure time in dark rooms. 
quote:
The one shot lens system does not compete with my IPIX 185 degree lens. Not even close. Thats the system I am sticking with.
That setup works fine, too. If you like paying ongoing fees.
quote:
Now please go back to the phones and sucker another person on your piece of JUNK 0-360 lens.
Nice try. Actually, I covered the logo on the side of my lens, so my customers won't know where to get one. They all say, "Wow! What is that?"
OK, I think this thread has run its course. Back to work for me. Just wanted to give the 0-360 its due praise.
Let me know if you guys find a good Flash viewer. Haven't seen one yet that doesn't add distortion.
< Message edited by vrphoto8 -- 4/29/2004 12:41:03 >
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JohnBoy
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 4/30/2004 16:56:27
I'm just sitting back - well said jimmy
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teq4
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/3/2004 10:39:52
Hello,
I read some parts of your discussion. You are looking for a good Flash VR player...
I recently developed for my company a Flash VR player that corrects the distortion.
You can see some samples here : e-Frogg's VR 360 player. We are working on it, and soon (some days) you'll have new samples we made recently.
Please, tell me what you think of it.
Thanks,
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Nigel
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/3/2004 11:27:47
I'd love to see your flash viewer but the link you gave doesn't appear to work.
Nigel
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teq4
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/4/2004 3:48:29
Yes, I know... Sorry, it was my web host (sorry, I'm frennch, so my english is a little poor...)
It should work now...
PS : I'm working on a new version, much lighter for processors, and much better for the eyes :) ... to be continued...
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Nigel
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/4/2004 4:49:44
Teq4,
Nice interface though the viewer is a bit watery on panning. You can only check dewarping properly with a spherical pano, I can send you one to use if you want.
If you would like me to test out your next one let me know. It would probably better by email as I think this thread is long enough already.
Nigel
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jeffrough
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/11/2004 22:41:29
I stumbled on this thread while googling for info. regarding the 0-360 system and decided to join this forum because of it.
I sure hope all turns out well, I should receive my lens tomorrow, my first job is this weekend.
I have had this client for about a year and they just asked for the virtual tour option. I will let you know how it goes.
All this info. has been real helpful, thank you!
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BobbyDouglas
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/11/2004 22:48:02
quote:
All this info. has been real helpful, thank you!
- Im so happy all of these experts just started to show up and show off their work.
Can you show us your work when you finish up this weekend's job? Btw, was it the actual www.0-360.com lens or was it another 0-360 degree lens? If so, which one?
Lastly, what camera are you using?
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jeffrough
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/15/2004 9:36:39
I will be shooting today, and yes, I will post them for you to see when I get them finished.
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jeffrough
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/19/2004 22:30:56
OK here they are.
http://barclayvilla.com/tour/360.htm
This is my first attempt and with what I have seen to compare with, this system holds it's own, especially when you take into consideration that I did not bracket my photos correctly to compensate for the window blast effect.
Actually I did set the camera for 3 shots but for some reason it made 3 shots of the same exposure, (I've got some learnin to do).
I will be going back to correct a few of the views, but overall I am very pleased with my purchase of the 0-360 system and i would recommend it to anyone.
Jeff
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BobbyDouglas
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/19/2004 23:08:07
Not bad... but I do think that the images look very disorted in the output...
Could you try to use the software that comes with the 0-360 and show us an eample of that?
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jeffrough
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/20/2004 7:37:09
I believe what your referring to is the "soft-filter" effect I applied when enhancing the images. Maybe it's a relative issue on whether the images are actually enhanced or not :)
I will create a few of these and post output directly from the manufacturers software. Just give me a couple of days to get to it.
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helge
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/22/2004 8:00:54
Hi guys,
i found another warping Flash Player.
At www.flashvr.de you can check out there FlashVR technology and download the orig. fla-files for testing there tec.
Another possibility for creating Flash panos is to convert QTVR to Flash.
There is an interesting tool at this site: www.qtvr2flash.com
In my opinion the program is a little bit buggy and the result of the file size is to big.
It takes to much time for loading.
to Bobby
To create the FlashVR movies is not the problem. There are some tutorials on the net,
they show you how to code it.
The bigger problem is to set the points onto the map and to program there interaction.
It took also a little bit time to set the correct "viewangle" onto the map.
I have had created a Flash Player before, but not with these multifunctional interactivities
with a map and so on, like one site before.
And if i`m enthusiastic and convinced from an idea, then i can work 20h a day. ;o)
Helge
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Nigel
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/22/2004 16:46:17
Helge.
Here's a house tour made with the same flash viewer:
http://www.mediatek360.com/home.html
It's certainly moving in the right direction now though still limited to cylindrical panos. I have no doubt it will get there in time. If you can create a full 360 x 180 flash viewer that will dewarp images I know a lot of folks who will pay for it.
Jeff,
Thats Ok for a first effort but you couldn't really sell those commercially. Can you post some more when you get the bracketing right?
Nigel
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helge
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 5/24/2004 10:05:48
jepp, the mediatek360 uses the same viewer.
The developers of this viewer uses the same ideas to simulate this warping effect - define slices, use them as masks and scale them from the middle of the panorama till the borders - that`s the easiest way.
That looks okay and like the competition of Java or QTVR.
It`s more difficult to find a way to warp or stretch the pano horizontal up or down.
To programm this you need definitively a good working algorithm.
- - - - - -
Has anybody an idea if the new developed 360° Lense from Sony is useable?
http://www.sony.net/Products/SC-HP/cx_news/vol34/featuring2.html
It sounds good what they wrote but if this one is better as the other one shot lenses?
Hmm,
okay, bye Helge
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BobbyDouglas
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RE: 360 Degree Tour (Flash Maybe?) - 6/1/2004 11:25:04
Maybe... But if you take a look at their web site, almost no information is on it about the program at all.
Their site map consists of one link that isn't even in their web site. I definately would think twice before I installed their software.
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