Newbie PPC Question (Full Version)

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dalesellers -> Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 11:18:42)

I've been researching putting keyword ads on Google and Overture. I’ve read a lot but I just can’t seem to find the answers to a couple basic questions:

When I don’t bid high enough to get into a top listing, what results should I expect to get from keyword(s)? Will my ad get no views or just a smaller percentage of views compared to the top listing?

What’s the easiest way to test different landing pages under the same keywords?

Thanks for any info.



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 11:23:22)

during the process of signing up, you enter a bid amount and google will tell where that amount will place based upon CURRENT bidders. if you dont like that tanking, try another amount. what actually happens is all the bidders for that keyword are ranked and if there are more than one page worth, they lower ones fall to page 2 so ironically, the top bidder will only be #1 on page 1, 3, 5 etc.

i didnt understand the question re landing pages



dalesellers -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 16:30:07)

dpf-
With Google ranking adwords, if I’m not in the top 5-7 listings, can I really expect to see much traffic? Many sites that host Google adwords ads don’t even have 2nd pages?

As far as “the top bidder will only be #1 on page 1, 3, 5 etc” - could you please explain ( I don’t get it).

With landing pages, I’m trying to figure out how to simultaneously test two landing pages (compare the conversions between the pages) for the same product by using the same Google ad. My guess is that the only way I can do it is with some of the 3rd party software I’ve seen. Get any ideas?



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 16:40:32)

quote:

Many sites that host Google adwords ads don’t even have 2nd pages?

im not sure we are on the same wave length here....sites? i was referring to search results where my ads appear. in some categories, there are so many people paying for those words, they cant all apear on one page so- the lower rankers appear on page 2 of the search results ( which means the top bidders are not on page 2!) page 3 posts the list over again on 3 and 4..etc.



dalesellers -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 16:52:48)

Sorry for the confusion - I was referring to how the keyword ad results that show up on both Google and all of their AdSense sites. Thanks for the help.

Anyway, It really tweaks my curiosity why someone would go through the trouble of bidding low on a keyword ad when it’s only going to get them on the 5, 6, 7th page of results on a Google search. When most people go to Google, from what I’ve seen, they don’t make it past the first couple of pages?



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 20:08:41)

quote:

when it’s only going to get them on the 5, 6, 7th page of results

no, that isnt what i said - it will get them on the 1st page! if the keyword only has enough bidders to fill one page, they will be on every page. only if the number of bidders requires 2 pages will they not be on page 2 - but they will be on 1,3,5 etc.



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/18/2004 20:10:40)

quote:

bidding low

maybe i misunderstood you..bid low - you mean its not worth bidding low if you arent on the first page? well, before you bid on a keyword, you search for that keyword - see how many ads are there. usually it is one page - some times 2



Giomanach -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 7:20:19)

This thread just totally loses me....

But anyhoo..AFAIK..the highest bidder doesn't always get #1 placings in a search engine whether it be via Adsense or actually on a search. The highest bidder will only have more chance of being found on the Search engines

And as for Adsense, the ads display links/descriptions relative to the page content, not the highest bidder. The highest bidder will only have more chance of getting on there more often, and at the moment, i fail to find two of exactly the same ads when I view a thread on here twice...they are different everytime.

I am speaking with very little experience here, so ignore me if you must

Dan



dalesellers -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 10:41:18)

Thanks for the info - I think I have a better understanding of what's going on.



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 10:46:12)

quote:

I am speaking with very little experience here, so ignore me if you must

sorry Dan but I must.... Google adsense does not impact where you place in the actual search..... it involves what are clearly ads and over on the right..the ads are linked to precise keywords that you bid on - no relationship to meta keywords.... you can bid as many as you want. if your bid for a particular word or expression is #1, you will be listed #1 - not in the search list on the left but the ad listing on the right. tommorow someone could outbid you

PS you dont pay to be listed in the ads - only if someone clicks on your link



Giomanach -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 10:51:19)

Like I said...I have very little experience in this subject...it is in my "To Do List", but I gotta start somewhere, might as well be here. I know very little about it....just trying to get the rest learnt whilst working..learning other stuff...moderating two other forums...you know...tight schedule...[:D]



Reflect -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 13:06:38)

The key here is to bid for slot two or three. Why get into a bidding war?

I haven't been active on this for a few months. However I played devils advocate with my competitors. I placed a rather large bid to secure the first slot. My competition reacted in the second day of my campaign. At this point I low balled for third slot and let them fight for the first slot. There was quite a difference in the prices. I just sat back and chuckled.

quote:

When I don’t bid high enough to get into a top listing, what results should I expect to get from keyword(s)? Will my ad get no views or just a smaller percentage of views compared to the top listing?


Just shoot for third. As long as you have the top three your add will get shown. Now I know that they show more than three results but if the rules haven't changed then the SEs that also use these results only show the top three on their ads. As DPF stated you would fall on page two...etc.. How many views and clicks depends on the target keywords.

quote:

Many sites that host Google adwords ads don’t even have 2nd pages?


You are now referring to AdSense which is different from AdWords...

http://www.google.com/ads/

quote:

With landing pages, im trying to figure out how to simultaneously test two landing pages (compare the conversions between the pages) for the same product by using the same Google ad. My guess is that the only way I can do it is with some of the 3rd party software I’ve seen. Get any ideas?


For this approach, using low tech means I would run an ad for two weeks. Note your conversions. Then I would edit the campaign and point it to your next test page or just edit the original page. Note the conversions and then compare.

quote:

im not sure we are on the same wave length here....sites? i was referring to search results where my ads appear. in some categories


This is the same as above, two different programs...

http://www.google.com/ads/

HTH,

Brian



Mojo -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/19/2004 13:29:24)

quote:

I have very little experience in this subject...it is in my "To Do List", but I gotta start somewhere, might as well be here.


When you are leaning you should be listening. Poor advise can often hurt people's income.

If your goal is to increase you post count and backlinks you can do it in the lounge.

"I can get it it over 3000 backlinks from PR7 pages" - Giomanach, 7/16/2004



dalesellers -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/25/2004 0:14:12)

I found what seems to be an affordable script that splits incoming traffic between two landing pages. John Reese recommended it on his site. Here's the link (no, I'm not an affiliate):
http://profitinfo.com/catalog/v4/

I haven't tried it yet and I'm curious if anyone else has. I also came up with a couple more basic PPC questions:

1. If there are several people bidding the same price on a keyword, how does Google determine who gets the higher ranking?
2. Google has a feature where you can set a maximum bid price on a keyword and then you automatically stay 1cent above your competitor for that keyword. What happens if a competitor for that keyword uses this feature too – does it make both of the bids shoot up if they were low in the first place? Thanks for any insights.



dpf -> RE: Newbie PPC Question (8/25/2004 9:38:03)

quote:

does it make both of the bids shoot up if they were low in the first place? Thanks for any insights.

I believe it does..as reflect says "bidding war"



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