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Kitka
Posts: 2515
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From: Australia
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/4/2005 21:25:13
I switched from NAV to NOD32 and am extremely happy with it.
Before I went to NOD32, I tested the Panda demo, but didn't like it.
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Kitka
**It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious.**
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Starhugger
Posts: 512
Joined: 4/12/2005
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/5/2005 10:44:55
With rare exceptions, whenever I hear of someone whose computer got eaten by a viral nasty, almost invariably they were using NAV. Mind you, there are still an awful lot of people out there who don't realise you have to update your AV regularly AND do a regular system-wide scan, and that will render ANY AV useless. But it seems interesting to me that NAV comes up as the one people were using more often than not. Maybe NAV is just not as good as other AVs, or maybe NAV comes bundled with new computers more often and so people don't go through the learning curve in choosing an AV themselves, I don't know. Maybe both.
About 3 computers ago, PC-cillin came bundled with mine. That's the people who do the Housecalls site. It found a virus but couldn't clean it (I thought, at the time, because it was a demo version). Long story short, I tried NAV and McAfee trial downloads and neither of them could find the thing; it wasn't in their databases either. Yet PC-cillin and Housecalls did; turns out it was some off-beat variation of a more common virus. Guess which AV I went with... Years later, I'm still with PC-cillin after a number of upgrades, and with only a few rare exceptions, have been completely happy with it.
Trojans can be really hard to get rid of. There's a program out there called Trojan Remover that my computer tech guy uses to ensure that it's GONE for good. I guess the AV programs have their first specialty in virii, not malware which is a relatively recent addition to their repertoire. They don't always catch the root program which can still propagate after the spawned trojan has been detected and wiped. I think they're gradually getting better at it, but I still run both AdAware and Spybot to catch most of the spyware and other malware, along with PC-cillin's spyware scan (which you still can't automate, which is annoying). They all seem to catch different things, so I think it's still worthwhile to run more than one program for spyware.
Starhugger
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clever
Posts: 4
Joined: 5/13/2005
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 6:30:08
:S
http://housecall.trendmicro.com/ wont work for me
same reason windows update doesnt work
the activex in my browser is shut off permently for some reason
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Kitka
Posts: 2515
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: Australia
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 6:45:38
quote:
http://housecall.trendmicro.com/ wont work for me
same reason windows update doesnt work
Are you using IE or another browser? I have Firefox set as my default browser, but have to <grrr> use IE for Windows Updates, online virus checkers and Internet Banking - all of which seem to require ActiveX..
Still, it is FAR better than having to use IE for all browsing.
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Kitka
**It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious.**
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clever
Posts: 4
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 8:58:23
i use firefox mostly but the activex in ie doesnt work and that also means my windows update hasnt worked for over a yea
and msn cant login because of a bad pass error which i think it because it cant get a ssl connection to the login server
also all https:// sites dont work on ie and multi os programs like gaim/mozila/firefox that have the ssl built into there own code can get at https:// sites and msn
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dpf
Posts: 7121
Joined: 11/12/2003
From: India-napolis
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 9:03:54
good post starhugger. I thinkyou hit a great point about new pcs. I thought about that when i bought my most recent one (my 12th - lol) a low end $700 Gateway. I thought "this is a system that many first time users will buy" and while the set up was nice and easy (color code calbes etc), since it came with NAV, I noticed that nothing tells the new user that 1. you have to actually run a scan 2. you have to update files 3. you have to renew subscription. I know lots of pcs "newbies" who say " I have such and such antivirus" but when you ask them questions #1 and #2 above, they are shocked
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Nigel
Posts: 382
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 13:10:22
I've been a Norton user for years - I've run McAfee and AVG on other machines - Norton has been the only one that keeps my system clean (thats Norton internet Security)
McAfee I found to be the least effective. Panda was almost useless.
In my experience the problems people have with Norton is setting it up correctly and keeping it updated.
Anti Virus on its own will not help against trojans and some worms.
I also use Ad-aware (paid version) - it's vastly improved since the early editions and catches stuff the anti virus progs dont see. One thing I have noticed with all the programs is that although they may detect something it cannot be removed while it is running. A lot of these trojans and worms install an .exe file that runs at first boot. What you have to do is stop it running and then clean it with whatever prog you are using.
You can do this by clicking:
Start/Run msconfig
A window will open and the last tab on the top menu - called startup- shows you what progs are running at startup. By unchecking the box you can reboot your machine, stop them running and clean them. Of course this doesn't apply to everything and there are some nastier ones out there that need more attention. If you get to that stage then a re-install of your sytem is often the fastest and most effective clean.
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5456
Joined: 5/15/2003
From: Arizona
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 17:37:11
quote:
With rare exceptions, whenever I hear of someone whose computer got eaten by a viral nasty, almost invariably they were using NAV.
- Not sure what the numbers are here, but I would think NAV would be used more frequently than other AV, thus more people would complain. Let me put it like this. There are 100 users of NAV, and 50 users of AVG. 10% of the users complain, that would be 10 users for NAV, and 5 users for AVG. You should expect more complaints for software used more than another. I wouldn't compare the clientbase of NAV to AVG.
I posted awhile back showing facts from actual tests, that AVG has one of the worst detection rates. But it seems a lot of people just go by "this has worked in the past, so it will work in the future", or "my friend uses this and he has had no problem".
quote:
AV and NIS are almost guaranteed to be what's causing it.
- Norton Internet Security is a real bad resource hog. It needs to be re-created from the ground up before anyone agrees to use it.
A lot of people do not understand that AV is the 1st thing that needs to be installed on a system. Top AV programs work best when they are installed before other programs/software. If you search for my thread regarding Norton, you will see many statistics proving AVG has a poor detection rate compared to the other tested software. AVG is pretty quick though, so if you are running a system that isn't speedy, it might be a better solution.
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5456
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From: Arizona
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/13/2005 18:15:34
quote:
I take back everything I said. It trashed my new machine.
- Oh man... Is that the one you were working on earlier in the week?
I decided not to use Ghost, instead I just do regular backups. All my software is burned onto my computer, and backups of that are also made. So it wouldn't take too long to restore. Plus, if my main drive dies, I just pop in my backup drive that already has windows installed.
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Starhugger
Posts: 512
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: offline
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/14/2005 1:38:16
quote:
ORIGINAL: BobbyDouglas
- Not sure what the numbers are here, but I would think NAV would be used more frequently than other AV, thus more people would complain. Let me put it like this. There are 100 users of NAV, and 50 users of AVG. 10% of the users complain, that would be 10 users for NAV, and 5 users for AVG. You should expect more complaints for software used more than another. I wouldn't compare the clientbase of NAV to AVG.
I have never used (or barely heard of) AVG, so I wouldn't know about any differences in client base. But curiously, most of the people I know don't think to blame their AV when their computer gets eaten -- at least not enough to complain directly to the company. I'm not sure why. Maybe they figure that the AV only protects them from some things and it's inevitable that they'll catch something (kind of like getting a flu shot), so they figure it was just "their bad luck." Maybe they are told by whoever repairs the thing that it was their fault for not updating it, so they're embarrassed. I don't think they feel connected to their AV company enough to complain, sort of in the same way they wouldn't call up Intel or Microsoft if there was a problem with the motherboard or opsys -- they'd call and complain to their computer vendor or whoever winds up repairing it, who would just fix it and maybe give them some instruction on how to prevent it happening again. I suspect it's all caused by a rather dysfunctional dynamic that is more complex than what one might see on the surface.
quote:
A lot of people do not understand that AV is the 1st thing that needs to be installed on a system. Top AV programs work best when they are installed before other programs/software.
Good point! If someone gets a computer that doesn't have a current AV pre-installed, it might not occur to them until well after they should have installed it.
Starhugger
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Starhugger
Posts: 512
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/14/2005 9:58:16
quote:
ORIGINAL: jaybee
Yup. Got it all set up, all the apps on, all the data and then thought "time to Ghost". I put a warning in Hints and Tips but basically Ghost doesn't like SATA drives. It starts to run, sets itself up as the virtual C: drive and then locks up. You can't get back into Windows as the real C: drive isn't seen any more. You have to download ghreboot from the Norton site and run it from a bootable floppy but of course my machine didn't ship with a floppy. Luckily Harv, being a Dell engineer had a compatible removable floppy for his work's laptop so I was able to use that. Anyone else would have been stuffed.
That sounds awful, jaybee! I was thinking of getting Ghost but I'm thinking maybe it's not a good idea to rely so much on one solution for backup. It seems it still pays to have more than one strategy, in case one turns out to be the Backup From H*ll.
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Giomanach
Posts: 6091
Joined: 11/19/2003
From: England
Status: offline
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/14/2005 19:56:35
Zone Alarm & Avast here....AVG wouldn't update, but it think that's due to me being dual firewalled (ZA & Router)
As to the HDDs...I still use IDEs...no SATA ports at the mo...but both HDDs are Ultra ATAs and run superbly
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GeorgeR
Posts: 77
Joined: 3/26/2002
From: FL
Status: offline
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/15/2005 11:52:41
I use Norton AntiVirus 2004, Webroot's Spy Sweeper, Ad-adware and a week ago I added the Spybot.
Norton's finds Gator trojans but fails to remove them. I update automatically and sometimes manually as well.
Recently I had a problem with the system that was rebooting and power-shutting down automatically. After several hours of efforts (in Safe Mode), I gave up and brought the computer to a shop. They found that Norton was corrupting the WinXP system.
My renewal is coming up in September, so you know I am dropping Norton and using something else.
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fade2black
Posts: 61
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: England, but now living in Southern Spain
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/16/2005 6:05:37
I purchased Norton Systemworks and Norton Internet Security. Since installing I have had to rebuild my pc 4 times. Everytime I had problems with NAV and Systemworks, mainly to do with the updates. It kept asking to reinstall by following instructions on their web site. I found this to be very long winded and to make matters worse, It would never recover. Hence, the rebuilds. The pc has been running without Systemworks for over a month without any problems. The internet security part is not a problem. So, I have resorted to another AV temporarily (freebie) and I will be requesting a refund from Symantec....yeah right! I chose them as Norton is the father of the PC, as far as I am concerned, so who better! But, it seems that Norton Systemworks instead of optimising your pc, actually screws it up completly. I have heard other people have had the same problem and have done what I have done. Not heard of AVG, but will check it out.
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5456
Joined: 5/15/2003
From: Arizona
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/16/2005 10:19:30
quote:
I purchased Norton Systemworks First mistake
quote:
and Norton Internet Security. Second mistake
quote:
But, it seems that Norton Systemworks instead of optimising your pc, actually screws it up completly.
- That software sucks! It takes up so much in resources.
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5456
Joined: 5/15/2003
From: Arizona
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/16/2005 12:16:35
Drive Image has been reccomended to me many times on hardware forums. I would give them a good look!
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dankos
Posts: 420
Joined: 1/10/2004
From: New York City
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RE: ditching Norton AV for AVG - 5/16/2005 13:37:44
I like a fair amount of control of how the AV package runs in the background. I run a lot of CPU intensive programs and don't like the AV to start spontaneously and run in the background. I noticed that NAV was extremely intrusive and replaced it with PC-cillin, which seems to be far less intrusive. I could tell that NAV was running in the background in that the PC would go through about 10 minutes of intensive disk accesses and then suddenly the DVD reader would open at the end. If it was open already, it would close -- pretty bizarre. This would happen several times a day.
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I actually had and used Ghost before Symantec bought it.
