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caz -> Code bloat, myths and wysiwyg editors (6/25/2005 13:10:32)
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"I fully expect FrontPage 2003 to create exactly the kind of markup that it always has done - proprietary, MS-oriented markup that breaks in all manner of wonderful ways in any browser other than Internet Explorer. We shall see ..."
How many times have you read or heard this type of remark? As users of FP and members of this forum we usually shrug our shoulders and carry on designing our own sites that are standards compliant, with clean code, and are cross browser viewable; heck, some of us even attempt to make them accessible.
Usually we concentrate on the fact that it is the user, not the tools used that is responsible for the end product-
To quote pageoneresults in WebmasterWorld forums,
" Arrrggghhh! Smell an FP site a mile away? I take offense to that. You must like the smell of Sterling Silver Roses because that is what my FP sites smell like! ;)
Nah, I can't bash either program, or any of the others that are in use today. It all comes down to the user, not the program. FP does have less of a learning curve than DW but, it all depends on what type of programs you are used to working with. As it has been mentioned above, if you are an MS Office user, than FP will be more familiar than DW. If you are a Macintosh user and utilize Macromedia products, than DW is going to be more familiar.
Yes, you can work on aspx sites using FP. The preferred editor for aspx is Visual Studio.Net or NotePad (Hehe). If you know the full power of FP, you can use it on any site. Add a plugin called PHP Rocket and viola, you can edit and develop in php.
If your authoring team is MS based, then you will probably want to explore an MS product as it will offer seamless integration. There are all sorts of plugins that you can add that give FP more functionality. And, FP 2003 is a force to be reckoned with in the right hands. Just as any editor is. Pssst, MS has this neat little backend called SharePoint Team Services, great little tool. "
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum46/347-2-10.htm
This usually earns some kind of patronising reply, just repeating that Frontpage generates bloat and often based on their last aquaintance with the program, which was probably FP98 at the height of the browser wars. Many academics and a surprising amount of fora moderators perpetuate this urban legend either from lazy research or just parroting what they have been told elsewhere. Even more are just biased against anything MS, or those who think that they are being clever.
There has been a comparison of wsyiwyg html editors on their ability to create clean code in .Net, May 2005. (sold as Web Builder in the US.). Five design agencies tested all four and the results provide an objective, up to date assessment - not outdated, received opinion. Their results may surprise a number of people:
1.Dreamweaver MX2004
2.FP2003,
3.Golive CS
4.Netobjects Fusion 8
They conclude that with all editors drag and drop functionality is not enough to build a decent website. If the user does not have a solid knowledge of how the software generates code, then unnecessary and erroneous code can be produced. Even with the almighty Dreamweaver...manual checks will still be necessary.
This article may be available before long at http://www.netmag.co.uk/
This updates an onsite opinion by giomannach http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/m-192823/key-html%252Ceditors/tm.htm#192828
From abbeyvet, sometime ago but still valid,
"I believe that the principal objection that the 'professional' web design community have to FP is that it allows anyone who takes the time to learn how to use it and has a modicum of visual aptitude to make a very nice web site. They are threatened by it. It proves the very thing they do not want proved, that making decent websites is not rocket science or brain surgery, anyone can do it."
http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/m-21743/key-frontpage%252Cbloat/tm.htm#21751
Other useful references are,
Using FP to produce accessible websites
http://www.webaim.org/techniques/frontpage/
WYSIWYG Editor comparison chart.
http://mvp.wiserways.com/2003/compare.html
It's important to remember that most people new to wysiwyg software tend to do their work in design view and rarely look at pages in code view - whatever package they are using. If giving advice on choosing editors it would be wise to remember this: a higher price does not necessarily mean cleaner code.
Just redressing the balance a little,
Carol
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