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pcguy
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New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 8:35:14
Hi All,
After months of development, and hundreds of hours of development, my site finally went live last night...
Please check it out, and let me know any feedback you have.
Thanks!
www.angelsmessage.com
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 12:31:15
Nothing wrong with the SitePal, but please make it so that it's turned off by default. In other words, let the visitor decide whether they want talking heads or not. When I entered the site, the face instantly started to speak.
Then one thing that instantly hit me when I saw the website...
The purpose and message of the site is mostly positive and beautiful, but you have chosen a Nazi font for your logo. It's chancery font with a hint of Schwabacher style and very dark in mood—I can also see from the poor quality that it's a free font. It's very close to a blackletter, and this particular style you have chosen can subconciously create a historical reference to the Nazi Germany. So, unless the site is about “Neo-Nazism for Kids” (please don't get offended), I'd recommend using a softer and more delicate typeface. There are many beautiful script fonts out there, so you have a lot to choose from (I guess handwritten or calligraphic style is what you were looking for in the first place). Script faces are especially powerful in tone, and when chosen well, can add a very peaceful and elegant mood to a design.
Here are the search results for “Beautiful Script” from MyFonts.
Probably more on the website later. In overall it's really nice.
EDIT: The font was Black Chancery, right? Links: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. It's a ripoff of a font called Schwarzwald, once released by a foundry called WSI-fonts.
< Message edited by anderskorte -- 7/8/2006 13:30:19 >
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 15:28:02
Yes, that's the font - didn't think of that - good catch...that was actually a temp font which I forgot to update...
You'll notice I used Vivaldi throughout the rest of the site (and even on the business cards and AngelGram)....can't believe I didn't remember to update that...thanks...
Vivaldi is one of my favorite "script" fonts, although its not really a scripted font - but you know what I mean. It kind of scripty, without being hard to read.
I'm not sure I agree about sitepal. Although it may be annoying to the veteran web designers, most of the general public who sees it, very few have even seen sitepal before, so it's a neat novelty thing. I have it set to only play once per session, so it will not play every time they refresh, or hit the same page (unless they click play again). After a while I will likely have them off by default, but for now, the comments are all positive regarding the "talking girl"...
I appreciate you comments. Thanks...always looking for input...
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 16:25:09
I don't see Vivaldi there... or then I've mixed that with some other Vivaldi. The only other custom font I see is the comic font that says “Latest News”.
This is Vivaldi.
Heh, I'm still amused by that Nazi font stuff. I'm glad you didn't take it too seriously.
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 16:33:02
Nah, I don't take offense too easily...not to mention I don't think many folks out there would associate a font to Nazi Germany, but then, you never know.
You might need to empty your cache, the new font is there up top (the logo/name)
I didn't see your example in your message....
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walrus
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 16:33:44
quote:
Nothing wrong with the SitePal, but please make it so that it's turned off by default.
Completely disagree with this!
I don't like talking heads at all, but if you are going to invest in this, then use it. No-one is going to turn it on for you.
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womble
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 18:03:12
Firstly I have to say that I don't think surfers the world over go round checking sites thinking "Hmmm...looks like a Nazi font to me - I'll go somewhere else where they don't use a Nazi font." They're more likely to say "nice font", or "oh dear, that's difficult to read", or "I like that".
On the Sitepal, I don't like them. To me they're tacky and gimmicky and say "My content isn't interesting enough to attract people without a gimmick". It doesn't go with the style of the rest of your site, in my opinion spoils the look of what would otherwise be a perfectly fine site, and doesn't add anything. Yes, maybe if someone's never seen one before they might think 'isn't that clever!' but they're quickly going to grow bored once they've seen one. It's a lot of expense for no real return as far as I can see.
The background image that you have is lovely, but the background image doesn't go with the style of the rest of the site which I feel is too business-like and polished for a background like that.
Now being cynical, I have a problem with this whole concept. Maybe it's me, but when you advise people to leave their Angelgram somewhere safe, with their will or in a safety deposit box, it strikes me that it would be cheaper and simpler, and more personal, to cut out the middleman and leave your letter, tape or CD, or video/DVD with your will in the first place, and I can imagine that a good proportion of the viewing public will have similar thoughts (and of course they don't cease to exist in the event that the company longer exists - just me being cynical again). It seems your main selling points are security, but if you're recommending the Angelgram's kept somewhere safe like a safe deposit box, places like banks tend to have pretty good security too. That's the sort of reaction you're going to have to deal with from a cynical public though.
You also have a few small grammatical errors (apostrophes where none are needed) - only a small point but obsessive types are likely to pick up on that.
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~~ "A cruel god ain't no god at all" ~~
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 18:28:53
Thanks for the info...
Again, sitepal is preference. I myself will probably tire of them eventually as well...we'll see.
As for the concept - sure people can leave their own tapes, letters, etc. What happens if there's a fire, or the tape deteriorates? This issue can be debated ad nauseam, but the simple fact is it does appeal to some people - we did a fair amount of surveying before we put this together.
There are all kinds of things you "can" do, but "would" you? You can go to legacy.com and look up someone who died, and write an online "memorial" to them or their family. It only last for like 30 days, unless you pay $70+ dollars....would you? Probably not....but there are tons of people who do...and those are the people you target.
This concept by itself, is somewhat "provocative", which actually helps promote it.
Not sure where the grammar issues are, I went through it pretty well, or so I thought. If you can, let me know where they are...
Thanks again for the feedback.
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/8/2006 23:23:20
thanks!
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 2:13:37
quote:
ORIGINAL: womble
Firstly I have to say that I don't think surfers the world over go round checking sites thinking "Hmmm...looks like a Nazi font to me - I'll go somewhere else where they don't use a Nazi font." They're more likely to say "nice font", or "oh dear, that's difficult to read", or "I like that".
Well, they won't say anything because typography works subconsciously. No one will ever consciously notice the blackletter-Nazi connection. No one browsing the site will care about the legibility of some typeface. But it has an important role in the site's message, and this “Angel's Message” in Black Chancery here is an example of a design where style and message conflict badly. A typeface affects the meaning of a word.
The reason I speak so much about typography is because it's the most overlooked field in design.
< Message edited by anderskorte -- 7/9/2006 3:39:04 >
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 4:48:51
Sorry to jump off topic, but I just found a perfect article concerning that last font debate. The discussion starter is Vincent Connare, the designer of Comic Sans.
Are you feeling the font?
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Tailslide
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 5:20:39
Gramatical errors - ones I found at a quick glance were:
quote:
Privacy - Your message's ...
Integrity - Your message's...
Ongoing Memory - Your loved ones will be able to read the letter's...
Actually nearly every example of Messages was spelt Message's
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Little Blue Plane Web Design | Blood, Sweat & Rust - A Land Rover restoration project
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 5:49:02
quote:
ORIGINAL: Tailslide
Actually nearly every example of Messages was spelt Message's
And Angel's Message, too.
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walrus
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 6:20:00
quote:
And Angel's Message, too
What's wrong with that?
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Andy from Somerset
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 7:54:00
Please lose the SitePal. No-one will take your product seriously with an animated women (or man) on your site. As for the title font - I don't see what all the fuss is about. It was over 60 years since the end of World War 2 and although I accept there are still people around who are sympathetic to the Nazi cause, I doubt whether the overwelming number of visitors to your site will associate the font you have used with the Third Reich.
Andy
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Tailslide
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 8:16:33
Angel's Message is ok as long as the context is correct - i.e. that it is a message of an Angel (note singular).
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"My strategy is so simple an idiot could have devised it"
Little Blue Plane Web Design | Blood, Sweat & Rust - A Land Rover restoration project
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:06:08
quote:
ORIGINAL: Tailslide
Angel's Message is ok as long as the context is correct - i.e. that it is a message of an Angel (note singular).
Yes but the title graphic says “Angels Message”.
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Tailslide
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:12:28
I think that it's the Graphic that's wrong... well it definitely is wrong - it should either be Angel's Message or Angels' Message
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"My strategy is so simple an idiot could have devised it"
Little Blue Plane Web Design | Blood, Sweat & Rust - A Land Rover restoration project
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:29:46
The title has the apostrophe...
Angel's Message is the correct form if you are implying a single Angel.
I don't think there are any instances of it anywhere on the site without the apostrophe.
If I wanted to imply more than one Angel, it would be Angels' Message
If you see a title that doesn't have the apostrophe, and it's in a "Nazi" font ;-), then you need to flush your cache....
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walrus
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:31:04
quote:
Yes but the title graphic says “Angels Message
Now you've completely lost me
Please elaborate
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:32:30
quote:
ORIGINAL: Andy from Somerset
Please lose the SitePal. No-one will take your product seriously with an animated women (or man) on your site. As for the title font - I don't see what all the fuss is about. It was over 60 years since the end of World War 2 and although I accept there are still people around who are sympathetic to the Nazi cause, I doubt whether the overwelming number of visitors to your site will associate the font you have used with the Third Reich.
Andy
It's a design issue, the Nazi reference was just an example. The font choice doesn't fit the site's message at all, so it's a design mistake.
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Tailslide
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:35:55
quote:
ORIGINAL: pcguy
I don't think there are any instances of it anywhere on the site without the apostrophe.
The missing apostrophe in Angels aside (it's there in the new version) - the grammatical errors are where there are apostrophes in Messages e.g. Message's
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"My strategy is so simple an idiot could have devised it"
Little Blue Plane Web Design | Blood, Sweat & Rust - A Land Rover restoration project
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anderskorte
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:37:11
pcguy,
About the SitePal again. I'm pretty sure you've done user research and you base your choice of talking head animation on it. That's why I don't tell you to lose it completely.
But please make it turned off by default. Let the woman speak only if a visitor clicks on the play button.
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walrus
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 9:56:09
quote:
But please make it turned off by default. Let the woman speak only if a visitor clicks on the play button.
take a vote
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 10:09:25
My thought is, if it's going to be there, to make it speak automatically...
Many people won't know to "push play"....they will think, "what's that person doing there?"....
Like I said, it only talks once per session. I don't think that's bad...
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d a v e
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 10:27:36
i think it's ok for them to speak
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Andy from Somerset
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 19:21:56
quote:
It's a design issue, the Nazi reference was just an example. The font choice doesn't fit the site's message at all, so it's a design mistake.
With respect, you said the following -
quote:
It's very close to a blackletter, and this particular style you have chosen can subconciously create a historical reference to the Nazi Germany. So, unless the site is about “Neo-Nazism for Kids” (please don't get offended), I'd recommend using a softer and more delicate typeface.
I guess what I'm saying is that having an issue with the font on design grounds is fine but to criticise it on the grounds of it having Nazi overtones is outdated and totally irrelevant in the 21st century 
Oh and Pcguy, once again, please lose the SitePal. Some of the people who will be viewing your site are likely to be close to death. Do you really think they will want to entrust their last message to a site that uses an animated character? If you can't say what your site is all about in writing, then I think you need to have a re-think.
Andy
< Message edited by Andy from Somerset -- 7/9/2006 19:48:20 >
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pcguy
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RE: New Idea, New Site just went live! - 7/9/2006 21:41:01
It's obvious some people don't like sitepal. At this point, I think I get that...you don't need to keep posting the same thing about sitepal...
Thanks everyone for your input...
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