FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (Full Version)

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TravelswCharlie -> FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/30/2006 13:39:01)

I am a new member here and am also new to FrontPage.

I'm an "old" MS Word user, so I have it pretty easy until it goes beyond what I know from Word... such as menu-building.

I am having a perfectly lovely time here, reading about all the wonderful things that can be done with FrontPage, but can't find anything about the non-standard "nobr" used by FrontPage 2003 navigation bars.

Everything I've found (elsewhere) tells me to use CSS, but all I've seen must be coded one by one, rather than auto-magically building on the "navigation structure" as the native FrontPage does.

Can anyone tell me what is the latest best way to build menus that will validate?

Thanks,

CJ



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/30/2006 17:04:23)

Css is the best way to set up your menus, lean and mean. [:D] Take a look through the following tutorial and see how you get on. Come back if you get totally stuck.

http://www.projectseven.com/tutorials/css_menus/list_01/



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/30/2006 22:21:37)

OK, I'll go away and study for a while.

Thanks much,

CJ



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 8:49:23)


Here is some more information for you in regards to lists into navigational structures. There are tons of great tutorials out there for learning how to style them.

I have even ran into a few that recomend a defintion list for navigation as well.



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 15:42:07)

Thanks Deb and Jaybee,

Those tutorials, I think, are beyond me right now... I'd have to go back and learn more about CSS before tackling them.... and I really need to spend that time on creating content on my website. I got ahead of myself there and let it go live before I had enough content finished, so must get back to it.

I've read that the new "Expression" software due out in a few months will solve many FrontPage problems.

Is there hope it will solve the "non-standard" code <nobr>?



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 16:19:59)

You can download a beta of Expressions now. Give it a go, as long as you're not mucking around with databases it seems to behave itself.

Deb, there was a push to do navs in def lists for a while but the main protagonists have now backed down on them as it seems it caused accessibility problems.



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 18:52:12)

Jaybee, I'm not advocating either way of doing a list, just giving advice as to what is out there, such as Stu Nicholls definition list.

Also on Max Design there is a great amount of information on usage of definiton lists.

Its up to the individual as to what method they try to use.

And it is also up to me to share what I have learned along the way, and information that has been passed on to me to be able to pass it along to others. [;)]




TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 19:43:51)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jaybee

You can download a beta of Expressions now. Give it a go, as long as you're not mucking around with databases it seems to behave itself.


I've looked at that download, but unfortunately, I'm on dial-up, so it's probably impossible.

If it's available on CD I couldn't find it... do you happen to know if it is?

Thanks,

CJ



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 19:47:40)

is there a contact spot on the site that you could email someone to inquire about getting it on cd?



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 20:04:31)

quote:

ORIGINAL: c1sissy

Jaybee, I'm not advocating either way of doing a list, just giving advice as to what is out there, such as Stu Nicholls definition list.

Also on Max Design there is a great amount of information on usage of definiton lists.

Its up to the individual as to what method they try to use.

And it is also up to me to share what I have learned along the way, and information that has been passed on to me to be able to pass it along to others. [;)]


Deb,

I guess it's the fault of my monitor... in that the color of links is almost the same as the background... but I didn't even see your link in your previous message... nor in this one until I copied it in the quote.

I thought you were talking about the links in your signature. There is one there -- in the "tanfa" link -- that covers "fly-out" menus that looks exactly like what I'd like to do. But there was also so much discussion of various fixes that I decided it was not for this newbie.

I'm going to go take a look at those above... and also look at my settings in this forum to see if there is anything I can do to change those colors.

Thanks,

CJ



<edit for quotation fix



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 20:43:08)

Hi CJ,
I agree with you that Claire's fly out menu is a bit advanced. I believe that somewhere in the css forum in here she and Pageoneresults have posted the same thing. They both worked on it. I think it is pinned at the top of the forum in here.

The other links, such as listamatic, they take you through the basic lists and work your way up. Max designs, a site you should go through since you are just starting out.

There are many links in this forum that you could click on that would give you great information for learning.

And please, don't hesitate to post questions in here with anything that you are trying to accomplish.

For me, I try to stay away from too many hacks.

Maybe as I learn more I would get more detailed in things, but for now I am content with things that work good for me. Without many hacks within the pages.

Visit the Links Section In here, and you can find a whole ton of great information that many people in here have posted for those who are learning, or just need to brush up on something.

Good luck, and post away for help.[;)]



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (7/31/2006 21:10:46)

CJ

Not sure where you're based but the UK mags that are just coming through have Expressions Web Designer Beta on the cover disc. I got one today with Web Designer Magazine. Might be worth a trip to the shops.



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 10:29:21)

What is this program that he is discussing, and what does it do?



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 11:59:52)

quote:

ORIGINAL: c1sissy

What is this program that he is discussing, and what does it do?
It's the replacement for FrontPage.

Expression Web Designer



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 12:06:06)

Have you worked with it?

And, is it any better then fp? What are the benefits in comparsion to fp 2003?



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 12:27:55)

It's still in Beta so it has problems, particularly with databases but otherwise it's streets ahead of Frontpage.

It handles css, produces pretty much compliant code. Looks like Dreamweaver.

There was a thread on it here. I set up a test which is still there if you use the link.



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 12:56:28)

Thanks, Deb.

I had seen Claire's fly-out menus before, then was pleased to see messages from her and from pageoneresults here.

But it has been months since either of them last posted in that thread where they were talking about developing it.

It fits the format of my website perfectly. My website is more like a book to be browsed, with flyouts displaying subjects the user didn't know to request... rather than a technical site where the user knows to look for certain things.

... in response to your question is there a place on the Expressions download site where one can ask for a CD... the answer is PROBABLY no. I looked and didn't find one.

Thanks for that list of links... that will be very useful!

CJ





jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 13:09:57)

CJ, check the mags for cover discs. Otherwise, if you know someone with broadband, get them to download it and burn it to disc for you.



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 13:20:56)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jaybee

CJ

Not sure where you're based but the UK mags that are just coming through have Expressions Web Designer Beta on the cover disc. I got one today with Web Designer Magazine. Might be worth a trip to the shops.


I'm in Texas, USA, and should be able to find any magazine that has it.

btw... I did try to download it last night...

I knew the chances were good that my ISP, Netzero Premium, would drop the signal during the download, but I HOPED there would be a way to restart and continue the download.

Using Firefox's Download Manager, I set it up as went to bed. I woke up in the middle of the night and went to check... and sure enough, the signal had been lost and MyDownloads had a 60 meg "part file".

I tried "retry" in Download Manager, but it would not restart the same download... would just start a new download.

I went to Firefox support and searched for messages on the subject, and found that "yep" that's a problem with Firefox's Download Manager.

I went through the same thing with "Microsoft Visual Web Developer 2005", which everyone was having a hard time with... but Microsoft had that one fixed so the download would continue... so I eventually got it... but now it appears I don't need it.

I had read at the time that "Microsoft Visual Web Developer 2005" was going to be -- or at least was going to contain -- the replacement for FrontPage.

Do you know what is the situation there... should I just delete that program?



jaybee -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 13:33:29)

I've not used it so I can't tell you whether it's any good or not. The only way to tell is to build something then look at the code behind the page.

All the other MS products that allow you to set up web pages, Word, Excel etc put reams and reams of code in. As that is part of visual studio I have no reason to suspect it'll be any different. It does however have the advantage that it's free.

It really depends where you're going to position yourself. If professional is what you want then I'd go for Expressions.



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/1/2006 21:48:04)

Thanks, Jaybee,

I really appreciate your taking the time to help me.



c1sissy -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/3/2006 10:35:07)

If you have msn messenger, maybe someone here that has the program could send it to you via messenger. Might work a bit better for you doing a file transfer through this method.



TravelswCharlie -> RE: FrontPage Menus that are W3C compliant (8/7/2006 2:19:10)

Deb and Jaybee,

I tried your suggestions to get the CD without success.

Then it occurred to me that I gave up too quickly on the dial up download, and that I should look for a download manager that would keep re-starting a dropped download until finished.

I went on 'DOWNLOAD.COM" and did some searching around, and came up with:

http://www.internetdownloadmanager.com

It worked beautifully. It took a long time, of course, but since it could run unattended while I was away from the computer, even all night, that didn't matter.

It chops the file up into segments, then just perks along, downloading as long as it has a signal; then if it gets dropped it just re-tries until it gets on again, then stitches the segments together, throwing out anything that wasn't complete, and starts again.

It somehow manages to retain the sign on info... user name and password, necessary on the Microsoft site and also my ISP.

If I needed to use the computer, I just paused or stopped the download and it started up again afterwards... once, even after I did a re-boot. A download could be continued over days if necessary, so it truly takes all the pain out of downloading for the dial up user.

I was still a bit cautious when I installed EWD to see if it really was all there and not corrupt... but it installed without a blip.

Very very smooth...

It's $26 or so after a free trial period.

I'm going to send them their money... it's worth it for just this one download even if I never use it again.







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