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jaybee
Posts: 14145
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Berkshire, UK
Status: offline
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Free Domains with hosting accounts - 11/7/2006 8:43:57
This is a warning for anyone who is given the option of free domains with their hosting account.
Sounds like a good deal but be warned, if you want to move away from that host you may have a problem. One particular host, a large host, informs you that you have to shut the account down, at which time your domain will get released back into the wild where you can then go and buy it back. (This is assuming you're fast enough to get it before somebody else of course).
If you have been using it for some time and it has many visitors and SE ranking then you're stuffed as all your visitors will either get a 404 or, in the case of this host, their homepage, while you wait for the domain to become available.
One of my new clients has 2 freebies and decided to move hosts due to appalling support. He shut the account as per instructions and 90 days later the host is still hanging on to the domains. All emails to them get a response of "wait 30 days".
I believe they have no intention of releasing the domains, hoping my client will offer to buy them.
If you find yourself in this situation then contacting the NIC for the domains won't help as the domain is usually registered in the Host's name not yours. The only thing I would suggest is forward planning. Set up your new host account and site under a new domain name, redirect the old domains to the new site. Put a big notice on the new site about the change of domain and then hang onto both for 3 months before shutting the old account down. At least then your customers have the chance of bookmarking the new domain and the site has a chance to get ranked in the SEs.
Either that or be prepared to pay big bucks to the host.
If anyone else has any sure fire suggestions on this please post.
_____________________________
If it ain't broke..... fix it until it is.
GAWDS
Now where did I put that Doctype?
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5455
Joined: 5/15/2003
From: Arizona
Status: offline
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RE: Free Domains with hosting accounts - 11/7/2006 18:43:32
Hosts have been doing this for awhile now. It really sucks. What is even worse, is that when domains expire, you have a very limited time to renew it after expiration. Lots of registrars now charge $160-$200 to renew an expired domain. After the domain expires, the registrar can keep or delete it, they do not have to guarantee that it will stay in redemption.
quote:
informs you that you have to shut the account down, at which time your domain will get released back into the wild where you can then go and buy it back. (This is assuming you're fast enough to get it before somebody else of course).
- I've never heard of domains being released like that. When a registrar registers a domain, it is going to be taken for the duration of the registration period. There isn't a way to register a domain and then cancel it and have it go back into non-registered status.
quote:
He shut the account as per instructions and 90 days later the host is still hanging on to the domains. All emails to them get a response of "wait 30 days".
I believe they have no intention of releasing the domains, hoping my client will offer to buy them.
- This reminds me of some policy/law regarding domains and hosts that makes what they do 100% illegal when they don't return the domain name. If you can e-mail me the host information, and forward some of the e-mails over, I can try to get some confirmation on this.
quote:
If anyone else has any sure fire suggestions on this please post.
- Try hard to get the domain unlocked. Then view the whois contact information and make sure that valid e-mails are listed. Submit a transfer over at a registrar who uses Enom, and another one through GoDaddy. Enom orders seem to go quicker than the GoDaddy ones I have placed, but that could just be me. If you do it at both places, only 1 place will end up being able to charge you.
_____________________________
Arizona Web Design - Mr Bobs Web Design in Arizona
The Arizona Web Hosting Challenge
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BobbyDouglas
Posts: 5455
Joined: 5/15/2003
From: Arizona
Status: offline
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RE: Free Domains with hosting accounts - 11/8/2006 19:20:45
I sent this question over to a friend who runs a domain reselling service (somewhere around 2,000 resellers),
It sounds like it comes down to whatever is stated in the contract... Here's his response:
quote:
It's a gray area for the domain registration question. A domain is legally
considered a piece of property, according to the case law history and
various court decisions. Thus, a domain can be treated just like a piece of
land or a car, etc.
For example, a business might offer you a free cell phone with your
contract. But if you cancel your contract, they take the phone back or
charge you "extra" for it, or whatever.
With regard to the law, the same thing can happen with a domain.. Although
in reality it's much more difficult to enforce.
It all boils down to whatever contact the customer has "signed" with the
host. If the contract stipulates the domain is "free" with a 12 month
contract, then after 12 months, the domain might still belong to the host,
but be allowed to be used by the customer. Terms of the contract should be
clear to show who will own the domain after the contract is ended, just like
who owns a car after the lease is finished or a house after the mortgage is
done, or the cell phone after your 24-months are paid. :)
If the customer decides they don't like their contract and prefers not to
pay, then the host would be entitled to "keep" the domain name, assuming
that's specified in the contract.
I hope that makes sense.
The reality is that it's extremely difficult for a hosting company to "keep"
a free domain away from the customer, unless they are a small business and
have time to manage things like that in detail.
My understanding is that most large companies that give out a free domain,
put the domain into the name of the customer. If the customer doesn't stick
around or pay their bill or fulfill the contract, then they are sent off to
collections for the cost of the domain, plus extra to pay for the collection
process. That's big business for you.
Most small companies that give out a free domain, do it as a "loss leader".
They basically hope the customer keeps paying and staying as a customer,
since these smaller companies don't have relationships with the collection
companies, nor have the ability to risk their reputation by sending a
disgruntled customer to collection, etc.
and some more:
quote:
With a cell phone, the company has a one-time fixed cost, so it's pretty
straight-forward.
For a domain, the company must renew it every year. Usually what will
happen is the company will stipulate that they'll continue to pay for the
registration every year as long as the client is a customer. In this case,
the company typically "ownes" the domain and the contract is effectively an
agreement to allow the customer use of the domain. The legal precident for
this is clear -- whomever pays for the domain owns it. If the customer isn't
paying for it, then they don't have a legal claim to it.
Keep in mind that ICANN policy is not necessary legal. A policy is a
policy, but the law can be a separate thing altogether. Although usually
the law will uphold a policy and use it to judge who is right/wrong.
At the end of the day, the contract should be clear as to whom retains
ownership of the domain when the contract term is over. Most companies
don't include anything about this, because doing so would lock them into
whatever they wrote. It's easier for a company to cry ignorance later, once
some customer challenges them.
But generally, whomever pays for it owns it. I would never never never
never recommend anyone use a domain for their business if it's "free" with a
hosting account. :)
_____________________________
Arizona Web Design - Mr Bobs Web Design in Arizona
The Arizona Web Hosting Challenge
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