Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (Full Version)

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peterW -> Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/19/2007 12:10:01)

Hi all,

have been recommended putting this request here by another forum user, so here goes.

Having spent quite some time upgrading Panoramic Earth and it has gone live in the last couple of days.

I would really appreciate any feedback and comments about the site. Helena (Yoho) is already on to me about Accessibility stuff, but comments from others welcome.

The site provides panoramas of places to see linked to Google Maps with local descriptions. In order to prevent the whole page, and thus the google map, reloading every time someone looks at a new image, much of the content is dynamically driven.

One problem I have found with it presently is that the Google Ads on the site (often) do not have any bearing on the rest of the page (like the Singapore locations. If anyone has any ideas as to how Google Adsense interacts with Ajax sites that would be really helpful. That then leads on to how Google and other SEs crawl this kind of site.

Thanks in advance for any comments and snippets of advice you care to pass on!



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 6:22:48)

Hi Peter, big improvement over the original version. Accessibility is your big issue on there but some areas there's not a lot you can do with out considerable work.

As regards Google Ads. They display based on page content so if the text says a lot about Singapore then you get Singapore ads. If the text talks about restaurants and hotels then those are the ads you'll get. At the moment on that page I get Singapore ads.

It also takes a while for Google to work out what to display so when the page first goes up you'll probably get disaster relief ads or similar.

If I was going to change anything it would probably be the header graphic but that's just my preference.

Flaming heck, Singapore has changed since I was last there. No pics of the Botanic Gardens?



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 6:33:14)

Now as far as Google crawling the site. Googlebot follows links to pages and then reads whatever is displayed. It reads, sort of, the code behind the page so if you do a view source, it works its way through that.

If there are no links for it to follow then it won't find the pages. You need a site map that lists every major page and is linked from every page. You can do a normal HTML map for humans and an XML map specifically for Google. Corey posted a link to a generator here.



peterW -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 17:15:59)

Jaybee,

Thanks for the observations. Sorry no image of Botanic Gardens - one of the places I did not manage to get to. That got sacrificed in favour of 1.5 days photography in Bali (yet to begin to be added...)[;)]

Re sitemaps - in hand should be there soon. I asked Google about the Adsense issue - and actually got a response from them - within a day! (yeah, had to pick self off floor too). Basically the upshot was that the Googe Adsense can not read AJAX sites well. Hopefully will be able to put together a workaround for that shortly. Thanks for the link, will follow it through.

Peter



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 18:10:55)

Ajax is new, the current buzzword, inaccessible and other problems but you're stuck with it. So get some content in the page another way. Can't you have a short description in plain text that loads into a box underneath the map? I don't know how your data is stored but if it's a database have a text field stored with the image that loads along with the picture. Or have a sentence on the page that is a standard description but replaces the place name with the current one. That could sit at the top. Something along the lines of Panoramic Earth Information on Singapore

Having said that, the Google ads were coming up fine for me and there is some place info on the page:
quote:


Direct link to this pageAsian Civilisations Museum (picture by Peter Watts)
Map data ©2007 TeleAtlas - Terms of Use
Map
Satellite
Hybrid
Asian Civilisations Museum
Travel information with panoramic images linked to an interactive map about the sights and attractions in Singapore from PanoramicEarth.com

Address:
Empress Place, Singapore 179555, Singapore

Travel and Transport:
MRT North-South (City Hall, NS25 or Raffles Place, NS26), East-West (City Hall, EW13 or Raffles Place, EW14)


I don't know if we have any Ajax experts on here. It's so new that most of the geeks are over in geek places talking to each other about it. You also picked a heck of a time to post this. Most people have a weekend. [;)]



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 18:38:25)

Oh and word of warning, if you do go to the botanic gardens and you see the guy with the Fruit Bat, they're amazing creatures and by all means go stroke one but stand BEHIND it while you do. They have a knack of projectile peeing whilst hanging upside down and if you're peering closely at it....................... [:'(]



Nicole -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/21/2007 18:39:10)

Welcome to Outfront Peter!

A couple of comments:

1. Nice idea, but I do wonder just how long Google will take to do something similar anyway? They already provide images people have taken all over the place, they link to a Wikipedia style article on towns etc, so why wouldn't they just add panoramas next?

2. I visited Thailand just then. Lovely panorama and it's great how the google map shows which angle the camera is pointing while you're viewing the panorama, but in the case of the beach in Thailand, the pointer was pointing inland when the picture was of the ocean and vice versa?

3. The shade of blue in the banner just doesn't do it for me - and you also use other pastel colours that seem to me to be a bit uninspiring. It's a kind of travel site so shouldn't it be a bit more vibrant, brighter colours, some bolder. contrasting text? Images of holiday destinations?

4. Viewers on any screen resolution lower than 1280 x 1024 have to scroll to choose a destination - shouldn't that be closer to the top somewhere?

Like I said though, a good idea, hope it catches on.

Nicole



Tailslide -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 4:18:15)

I like it a lot - just spent ages looking around London where I used to live - got all nostalgic (sniff).

As far as the screen width goes - I'm fine down to 800x600. The layout re-sizes itself to suit the viewport width, I'm not getting a scrollbar at all...

Things I might think of changing?

I'd personally rethink the banner area. I'd have the logo at the left hand side and move the login boxes to the right hand side of the header.

I'd also think seriously about out-sourcing the logo design - I really hope that doesn't sound rude! A really good logo can make the difference between sucess and failure of a site as it adds to the air of professionalism and can seize the spirit of the moment. I'll PM you with a suggestion of somewhere to get a "pro" logo pretty cheaply (not me - I wish I was artistic!), I hope you don't mind.

Interesting site though - this is a prime example of why I like the web so much!



d a v e -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 4:59:13)

looks promising but i got stuck on the map in edinburgh. where do i find the panoramic view from there? or is there not one yet?

i looked at St. Peter's Basilica - View from Portico Entrance (picture by Peter Watts) which was pretty cool, but then i was wondering why there isn't an example panorama on the index page or a mini version in that right hand pane where it says recently added destinations?



peterW -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 5:08:09)

Nicole - Thanks for the comments. They will be added to a 'to-do' list. Not sure which beach you were talking about, but if you can let me know the location with the pointer problem I will correct it. After uploading about 400 of the critters in the past few weeks I get a bit pointer blind!

Tailside - Glad you liked the London stuff. It is where I am based at the moment. I think the shots there that I like the most come from inside the Natural History Museum and the Earth Science Galleries.

Points taken re site design and need for a logo!

Jaybee - I got a response from Google [sm=yikes.gif] re the AdSense stuff:
quote:

it looks like your use of Ajax is limiting how much of the site can actually be crawled for content. ... This is because our crawlers aren't able to derive meaning from images and dynamic media such as Ajax.

So I guess that says it all, back to the 'drawing board' for that one then....



womble -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 5:21:59)

/Wombley runs into thread and posts message

I had a look at this last night (was half way through posting on this thread when I fell asleep - no reflection on the site, just 14 hours straight at the keyboard isn't good for sleepy wombles [;)]) Once I'd figured out what to do, I had great fun whizzing round in circles looking at Menorca, where I had a number of holidays in my younger days, and though I've never been skiing and don't intend to start, Austria was great fun.

Looks good, although as the others have said, perhaps the general colour scheme needs to be a bit more vibrant, and the banner does need some work. Even on broadband it did take a fair while to load for me the first time last night, though there did seem to be a fair bit of congestion on the intraweb around here last night, so I'm not quite sure how much you can do about that.

Like I said, once I'd figured out what to do, it was fun, but it took me a while to get going - possibly cos I was a) half asleep, and b) am a womble of very little brain. I'm wondering if possibly the link to the instructions could be a bit more prominent and/or whether you can have some sort of demo on there. I know using Flash 'n' stuff brings even more accessibility problems, but may be worth considering. <edit>Duh! Ignore last comment - Wombley didn't bother to read the instructions on the right before launching in! [:D]</edit>

Finally (and I realise this is only a "young" site), you currently only have limited areas of the globe covered. Do you take all the pics yourself? I'm wondering if you could enlist the help of others in widening your coverage, and possibly adding a travel themed discussion forum to help with that, and provide another avenue for promoting interest in it. I'm also wondering if rather than relying just on Google ads, you could approach local businesses in the areas you've got covered to advertise on the site - more targetted than Google ads and another revenue stream.

Hmmm, Ajax???? Is it really a good idea to clean a server with a harsh cleaning product like that? [8|]

/wonders what this "weekend" thing is of which Jaybee speaks...

/runs out again and carries on coding PHP [:D])

/pops head round door to the thread again...

btw, welcome to OF! [:)][:D]



peterW -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 5:32:29)

Wombley - Thanks for the comments.

  • Yes the site is young, only a few days old in fact!
  • Yes, to date all the photos are my own. One of the major changes is the ability for anyone to submit their own panoramic images to the site, have yet to get the message out re that one. So hopefully I will be able to give my shutter finger a bit of respite in the future.
  • Google Ads were the fastest way of getting some income to (partially) cover the costs, but do expect to expand and change how the advertising works in the future.
  • Forum, web blog, travel directory are all on the cards, once we have recovered from the push to get it this far!

So, learning to walk but getting there slowly. Now I too must wrench myself away from the screen and go somewhere else. Hm, Jaybee what did you mean by that 'weekend' thing?[;)]



Nicole -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 5:46:36)

Hi Peter,

It's this one:

http://www.panoramicearth.com/destination.php?ref=258

But upon looking again it's not as bad as that, the line on the map kind of indicates where the extreme right of the panorama is and I expected it to be the middle.

I've just had a thought though, instead of using a line, can you use a triangle shape to show the area that is currently in the panorama?



Mike54 -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 7:56:32)

First of all let me join the chorus of welcomes Peter. I think you've got a pretty cool idea, hope you can fill out the destinations.

Starting from the home page it can take a bit more drilling down to get to the final image than I would normally take. Using the Site Map is certainly a much quicker method.

Are there different options for the links on the maps? Neither the balloons nor the throbbing blue circles appeals to me. The balloons would be fine if there are only a few links on the map but when you get to Budapest it gets quite crowded...[&:]

Also, I noticed when scrolling a pano that you can scroll it either left or right but if you go to far up from the bottom it scrolls down and you can't get it to go back up? (picky, picky [;)])

Note: Is there an error here?
_LEFT_ LEFT in the left corner... I did come across that on a few pages.

On the whole I think the site looks pretty good though I have to agree with the others about the banner. It's a minus as it is now...



peterW -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 14:13:19)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nicole

I've just had a thought though, instead of using a line, can you use a triangle shape to show the area that is currently in the panorama?


Interesting idea Nicole, just a couple of things about it, to use a triangle to show the area viewable would potentially need resizing the triangle with different browser windows, as the viewable area adjusts to a max and min as you resize the browser window. Also, redrawing a triangle as the image rotates means yet more drawing time and could make the movement of the direction locater and the image more jumpy.

Regarding http://www.panoramicearth.com/destination.php?ref=258, how far in did you zoom the Google map? Once you go to the max available image I think you may find that it matches the coastline.

Mike54 - The image up/down movement is an occasional bug. Not really sure what causes it. Have thought about resizing the image frame so that there is no need for this movement, but this needs to be balanced against screen sizes to try to keep both the map and image visible without having to scroll up and down all the time.

Re many pins on a map - well, zooming on on the Google Map helps pull them apart. I have thought of trying to make the pins smaller, but also wanted to be able to differentiate different kinds of locations (churches / museums etc) from one another, and this becomes more difficult with small pins. Yet another trade off.

LEFT_LEFT error, happens with the old applet maps, aware of, and will get round to in due course. More of this data will move over to the newer Google maps, and in the end probably only the ski resorts will be left running the applets as they need piste maps to make any sense!



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 14:34:48)

I don't make any sense when I'm Piste.



peterW -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 14:38:04)

No, you probably don't...[;)]



treetopsranch -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 18:37:39)

Those Panoramic photos are stunning in Firefox but fail to display in Netscape if you are interested.



jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 18:59:09)

Which Netscape? It's showing fine in mine.

It's also working in Opera but the User Name and Password boxes are sitting on top of the Panoramic Earth title.



treetopsranch -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/22/2007 21:10:12)

Netscape 7.1

I guess it's time to get a later version.




jaybee -> RE: Panoramic Earth version 2.0 needing review... (4/23/2007 4:20:34)

Ahhh I'm running 8.something or other which isn't exactly current. [:D]



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