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Dutch
Posts: 4
Joined: 12/21/2007
Status: offline
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I can take it! - 12/21/2007 15:20:08
For background, I have no training in web design. I've learned by trial and error over the last 2 months. I've also read about 16,984 tutorials and articles on just about everything web related. This site was constructed using a blank page with Coffeecup. The honest feedback from seasoned designers and developers would be very helpful. Thanks for taking the time to look.
DDR Computer Co.
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d a v e
Posts: 4013
Joined: 7/24/2002
From: England (but live in Finland now)
Status: online
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RE: I can take it! - 12/21/2007 15:34:02
i'm not sure where to start but i thought this was funny
'this section [links page] of the site is currently under reconstruction and may cause viewing errors. Thank you for your patients while this site is improved and update'
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David Prescott
Gekko web design
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Tailslide
Posts: 5915
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Out here on the raggedy edge
Status: offline
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RE: I can take it! - 12/22/2007 3:26:33
Try reading it without the images on - you get a Good Morning text and a google ad and that's it! You should ensure that important text (and by that I mean your content) is actual text rather than images. This is for many reasons:
1. Google can't read text within images and so this will harm your search engine results.
2. I can't resize the text in images when it's too small to read.
3. People using screenreaders won't get anything at all and will go elsewhere.
4. People using PDAs won't get much that's useful either.
Sorry to sound so critical!
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"My strategy is so simple an idiot could have devised it"
Little Blue Plane Web Design | Blood, Sweat & Rust - A Land Rover restoration project
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treetopsranch
Posts: 963
From: Cottage Grove, OR, USA
Status: offline
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RE: I can take it! - 12/22/2007 6:39:05
Too much horizontal scrolling and that bright red is hard on my tired old eyes.
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Don from TreeTops Ranch, Oregon
"I've got a taste for quality and luxury"
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Dutch
Posts: 4
Joined: 12/21/2007
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RE: I can take it! - 12/29/2007 13:12:12
Good Morning,
Thanks to those of you who offered "constructive" feedback. I've taken your advice and implemented some changes.
The WAI checks have proved difficult. After the changes, I was able to pass level 1, but not by much. From what I've read here, my site isn't required to pass these checks, as I have no employees with disabilities who need to access my site as part of their job. I would however like the site to be fully accessible to everyone, so I'll continue working on this.
I don't like to offend tired, old eyes so I changed the colors and reduced the amount of graphics. I took as much text as I could out of the graphics and changed it to "regular text" with all Unicode fonts.
As far as horizontal scrolling goes, well.........I used a regular 15" monitor on one of my other computers and tested the site using all available screen resolutions. The only time the site needed scrolling, was at 800x600 resolution, or below. To test further, I asked a few "test rats" to change resolutions and report back with scrolling intel. All reports were the same, scrolling only occurs at resolutions of 800x600 or below. Please tell me you're not judging websites using an ancient screen resolution. I just don't think it's fair to complain about scrolling while using such a low resolution. Heck, you should be used to it! 
quote:
Ummm and as for "use the red buttons to navigate the site" do you honestly think your visitors are so stupid they need to be told that?
Stupid? Not at all. But I know several of my customers personally, which means I know their skill level. I've got about 10 emails about not being able to join the forums because they can't find out what their AIM, YID, or time zone are. I got gas in the car at Speedway today. There were several rules and instructions on the pump about what not to do and so on. Does that mean Speedway thinks I'm stupid? Those scoundrels! 
You see improvement? DDR Computer Co.
Oh, and for reference:
quote:
ORIGINAL: d a v e
i'm not sure where to start but i thought this was funny
'this section [links page] of the site is currently under reconstruction and may cause viewing errors. Thank you for your patients while this site is improved and update'
Incorrectly spelled offending content removed and page finished. To search for additional jokes, please visit DDR Computer Co. Thanks again for your expert input!
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womble
Posts: 5461
Joined: 3/14/2005
From: Living on the edge
Status: offline
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RE: I can take it! - 12/29/2007 16:39:03
I'm still not getting an awful lot of anything with images off - including navigation, which just disappears. As for WAI Priority 1, it doesn't look like you're anywhere near it - one of the checkpoints that springs to mind immediately is the lack of "alt attributes on your site. On your "NewPC" page (not that I'd know I was on the "NewPC" page because there's no indication of which page you're on - no hover or selected effect on the navigation, and no clue as to where I am in the structure of the site) you have a lot of text that's spilling out of it's boxes (again, that's because there's no fluidity in your design).
Visually, it looks good (though personally I'd centre the page), but under the hood you've a hell of a lot of problems going on there. My suggestion would be to get yourself off to Amazon and get a copy of The Principles of Web Design by Joe Sklar, which is aimed at complete novices and walks you through not only what's good design-wise, and the important principles of design, but what's good technically. The second book I'd recommend is Steve Krug's Don't make me think: a common sense guide to web usability which is an excellent book that anyone interested in web design should read. It's got loads of examples of what makes a good website that's easy for visitors to use and navigation structures that work - based on real world usability testing.
At the moment you've got navigation up the top, more a bit further down....and then a bit more, some forums, a bit further down from that. What's that make the customer think? They don't know where to look to find the button they want. It's not intuitive, it's making them think, and as Steve Krug tells us from real world testing and well known sites, the ones that work best are the ones that don't have us fumbling around, scratching our heads trying to find the right bit of navigation.
Forum - okay. Why do you have a forum on a business site? More to the point, why do you have a forum with only 4 members and 20 posts on a business site? Nothing will put customers off more than an almost empty forum. Online communities, which is what forums are, don't happen overnight, and are best not linked with a business site, or if they are, they need to be good and busy. Is the forum the best and most professional way to provide support? Would a knowledgebase be more effective, or maybe just a plain old contact form. Think like a customer (and I admit, I'm a very cynical customer). Customer comes along and thinks, "Hmmmmm, a support forum...."...gets to the forum and thinks either, a) why does this guy have an empty forum, he obviously has no customers, or b) why's this guy got a forum with a few of his mates asking staged questions trying to look like they're customers? Obviously I've no idea if they're real customers or not, but your cynical customer who's wondering (albeit maybe not consciously) why your site's full of ads, is gonna be wondering that and thinking maybe that other guy's site just down the road looks a bit more professional.
From the forums:
quote:
This site, like every other site, is best viewed with FireFox. I've been testing updated pages with Internet Explorer 7 and have most of the bugs worked out. If you have a funny looking page, try refreshing the page. If that doesn't help, I'm probably working on it.
At least you didn't say that on the main site! Never tell a visitor what browser they should be using - that's their choice, and forcing them to use a different browser to get the best from your site isn't good business practice. Your site should be tested and working on all the commonly used browsers, before you launch it, and if you're going to be working on pages, never work on them live - keep the original pages up and work on new versions in a test folder, not the ones customers are seeing. In a bricks and mortar store would you make major alterations to the structure of the building while you were open for business? I can see it now - you're having a new roof put on your store and you issue your customers with an umbrella as they walk through the door so they don't get wet if it rains and any falling masonary'll hopefully bounce off the umbrella! You wouldn't do it in a bricks and mortar store, so don't do it online!
And lastly - lose all the ads and the hit counter. On a business site it just doesn't look professional.
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~~ "A cruel god ain't no god at all" ~~
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Dutch
Posts: 4
Joined: 12/21/2007
Status: offline
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RE: I can take it! - 12/29/2007 19:11:48
womble,
I can't thank you enough for taking the time to be helpful and informative. Replies like this are exactly what I was looking for.
This site is a test site. It's hosted on a free server. I didn't intend on getting any business from the site until it's moved to it's proper domain and host. I asked a couple guys on a local forum to give the site a look and that generated 3 new customers, one of which is a new system build, my favorite. Empty forums are a turnoff, I agree, but I haven't told many people about this site yet. Most of those I've told, can't complete the registration. The few that did are not staged, they own machines that I built or brought back to life. Dbeau's comments were edited, which led me to add some words to the naughty filter. Over time the forum section will grow and it will be very useful. The gaming section will have it's own site, as well.
I've been building and repairing computers for a long time and have a solid word of mouth base already. I'm not really looking specifically for random business, but somewhere to direct all that word of mouth traffic. The majority of the visitors to my site will already know me, know someone who knows me, or be from my area.
I see your point on the navigation, and I can make those changes.
Coffeecup Visual Designer seems to render everything as a graphic. I want badly to pass those WAI tests, and if I use Coffeecup to build a site, I won't be able to. I was under the impression that the software I was using was correctly handling all that stuff in the back end. I'll be honest, I'm not sure how to fix all that. Know of any Coffeecup sites that work correctly?
Back to work......thanks again!
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