Any help is greatly appreciated! (Full Version)

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rollerskate -> Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 1:13:25)

Hi! I recently inherited the job of web designer for the bar my husband manages. I have no clue what I' m doing!

Everyone I' ve asked thinks it looks great. (You should have seen it before.) But, I would really like the opinion of someone who doesn' t know me & doesn' t think they' re going to hurt my feelings.

I' m really having trouble with the layout of the photo album pages. It' s hard to get the thumbnails small enough & still be able to tell what it' s supposed to be. [:j]

Anyway...the site is www.denimdiamonds.com
Any critiques, suggestions, etc. would be very helpful.



Seventh -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 3:43:15)

Welcome to OutFront, rollerskate!

Well, if you' re looking for honest critiques you' ve come to the right place. So here goes.

#1. Not sure what the cactus graphics have to do with the site.

#2. I think Arial or Verdana would be a better choice of fonts.

#3. I am looking at the site at a resolution of 1024 x 768. For me to have to scroll to read information at the bottom is simply bad design. I would suggest moving the content towards the top. This can easily be achieved with tables.

#4. The logo could be better - and by better I mean a little clearer. It seems jagged.

#5. I' ll try to do a simple mockup for you showing you the layout I think would help you out tomorrow.

quote:

It' s hard to get the thumbnails small enough & still be able to tell what it' s supposed to be.


You could always use descriptive captions for the thumbnails.



rollerskate -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 3:57:52)

The suggestions are very helpful. I' m actually working on updating the information on the site right now. (Coming Events, Dance Calendar, etc.)

Before you go to too much trouble...some answers to your suggestions.

quote:


#1. Not sure what the cactus graphics have to do with the site.

It' s a country bar...we have a big cactus lit-up on one wall of the bar & the boss wanted something to move.

quote:


#3. I am looking at the site at a resolution of 1024 x 768. For me to have to scroll to read information at the bottom is simply bad design. I would suggest moving the content towards the top. This can easily be achieved with tables.

I' m using tables...but I' m probably not doing it right. The only " training" I' ve had is the tutorial that comes w/FrontPage & the information on this website. (The info here is much more helpful.) [:)]

quote:


#4. The logo could be better.

It would take an act of God to get the boss to change the logo. There are a couple different ones we use, but the others are kind of busy. (And, I don' t think I have them on computer anywhere...They' re kind of old.)


Thank you very much for your help!!! [:D]



Seventh -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 7:21:18)

quote:

It would take an act of God to get the boss to change the logo.


Or a great graphics designer.[;)]



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 7:59:13)

Hi rollerskate,

Is the logo a thumbnail of a larger image? It was a fairly easy task to copy it and reduce the size without changing anything (for the worse[;)])


[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/6521/Fd92266.jpg[/image]



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 9:21:50)

In keeping with what Seventh mentioned how about something along these lines?
[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/6521/Us53648.jpg[/image]
Sorry ' bout the quality but it was tuff gettin' it down under 50k.[&:]
Hey, that was my " seventh" post.[:D][;)]



Seventh -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 9:45:09)

I was thinking more along the lines of this[:p]...


[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/5898/Ig13788.jpg[/image]



Helene -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 10:19:47)

Sorry to say that I have to side with Anon1 on this logo issue. I generally agree with everything our sage Seventh has to say, but in this case I think the addition of red and shading make a hard-to-read logo even more convoluted.

Them' s my two Canadian cents, but remember, that' s worth three cents, American! [:)]

(maybe the logo question should go over to the graphics section...?)




Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 10:43:22)

Hi Seventh,

I was trying to address each of your points.[;)] As for the logo it is possible to some neat things with red and some shadows.

[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/6521/Zx71753.jpg[/image]



Seventh -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 11:30:05)

quote:

Sorry to say that I have to side with Anon1 on this logo issue. I generally agree with everything our sage Seventh has to say, but in this case I think the addition of red and shading make a hard-to-read logo even more convoluted.


Hey, I agree. But it only took me two minutes to do in PSP 7.0. I was basically just messing with Anon1.[:D]

As you know, Helene, I prefer clarity to showmanship. But I hadn' t messed with PSP in so long I just couldn' t help myself.[;)]



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 12:00:58)

quote:

I prefer clarity to showmanship.

I wasn' t trying to show off, just trying to help. sniff[;)]

quote:

I was basically just messing with Anon1.[:D]

Jeez, what did I ever do to you.[&:][:p][;)][8D]



Peppergal -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 13:11:05)

I would like to add my two cents worth, that I don' t care for the background color. I would go for a color scheme more in keeping with " denim and diamonds..." Also, I would not put so many animated gifs on the site; they really take away from the site, in my opinion...one one page you have the floating disco balls, a flashing pumpkin, and a scrolling marquee. Too much movement.

And yes...the logo is too jagged; I like the ones posted here--looks hundreds of times better (except that fire red marble one Seventh, LOL![;)])

Your use of the " fancy fonts' like stars and stripes will only be seen by folks like me who happen to have that font loaded on the computer....everyone else will see those pages in Times new Roman or whatever their browser default font is. You could make a graphic for the top of the page with the font and then use regular Arial or Veranda for the body. (times new roman is really not good for the web...)

Front page 2002 has a nice thumbnail generator which could help you. Some of your images need to be " optimized" so that they don' t take so long to download; I' m on a dial up and your main pic took forever to download (my computer is pretty fast though)




Seventh -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 13:32:06)

quote:

I wasn' t trying to show off, just trying to help. sniff


[:p]Gotta pick on somebody...I' ve already attacked everyone else. But really, since I normally only use Fireworks and PhotoShop I wanted to see if I still knew what to do in PSP. That' s all.

Yours looks much better than the one I did. All in good measure.[&:]



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/3/2002 14:06:40)

The first one wasn' t mine, it' s the one rollerskate already has, reduced in size only.[;)][:D]

The second is still the same but embellished with some effects from IC. Nothing special as you know.[:j][8D] Someday soon I' ll get into PSP but for now I can do what I need in IC.[:)]

[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/micons/m6.gif[/image] whoohoo 10 posts![:p]



rollerskate -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/4/2002 20:37:55)

Ok...lots of great ideas here...but now I' m gonna need some help, because, like I said before, I really have no clue what I' m doing...I' m pretty much learning as I go.

First...I like Anon1' s logo...I was thinking of going Red, White & Blue on the site (kind of keeping w/the patriotic cowboy thing).

And you asked if the original logo was a thumbnail of a larger image...I guess the answer would be yes. We scanned it from some letterhead, I spent like 3 hours cleaning it up (one pixel at a time) in paint shop, and changed it from black on white to white on black & saved it as a bmp file.

Is there a better way to import graphix in PageMaker??


Second...Peppergal said
quote:

Some of your images need to be " optimized" so that they don' t take so long to download

How do I do that???


Third...Thanks Anon1 for the frontpage layout...It looks great, I' ll have to try it.




rollerskate -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/4/2002 21:53:35)

ok...I' ve made a couple of changes to the front page...How does it look?




Peppergal -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 0:10:57)

quote:

I' ve already attacked everyone else.


you big meanie, you![;)][:D]



Peppergal -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 0:18:50)

quote:

...How does it look?


Lookin' good...keep at it!

Optimizing a picture: if you have Paintshop Pro you can just open the image in the program. Be sure the image is active (click on it) and then choose " File, Export, JPEG Optimizer" (or you can use the shortcut in your tool bar, JPEG in a blue arrow...) A higher compression value will make the file smaller (but it will also make your image lose some clarity...generally I don' t optimize over the 20 setting unless the clarity isn' t an issue then I choose higher...15 to 20 is the average.) Also, check the resolution on your photos...for the web the average resolution should be 75 or so (I' ve even had it lower on some pictures)...the default resolution on my scanner is 150...I always have to manually change it to 75. Once it' s in PSP, sometimes I resize it to an even smaller resolution, depending on the picture.

I' m have no idea how to do it in Paintshop, but there are lots of folks here who use it and could tell you....just post the question on the graphics forum.



Peppergal -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 0:20:41)

I would be tempted to use a color scheme to match (or at least, compliment) the colors of the building itself.....



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 7:43:46)

Keep at it it' s getting there.[;)] Since I' m not a big fan of black web pages I would tend to agree with Peppergal. However if you were to adjust the colors of your links (afterthought) you should be able to achieve the red white a blue look (on a black background). You might want to reduce the size of your text a bit also (just my opin). I' m curious about your hours too, 7:00 PM to 3:00 PM???[:p]
[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/6521/Xu62688.jpg[/image]



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 8:36:48)

rollerskate,

Did you know that all the links are broken now on your home page?



LindaK -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/5/2002 23:44:09)

rollerskate,
I liked the idea of using the colors of the building, so I tried it out....here is what I came up with.

I also like the page limited to 800X600 and centered. When it stretches at different resolutions, there is too much " white" space around each component. I can post this sample if you want to see what I mean.

Linda

[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/upfiles/6506/Hf10397.jpg[/image]



Peppergal -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/6/2002 0:13:04)

OOOO, I like it....it works better with the cactus too....



Anon1 -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/6/2002 5:40:27)

Linda,

[image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/micons/m6.gif[/image] [image]http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/micons/m6.gif[/image]



Helene -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/6/2002 9:22:40)

Linda,

Talk about making an entrance!!!!
as my teen daughter would say... " you rock!!!"

Welcome to the party [:)]



rollerskate -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/9/2002 0:26:59)

I really like the green!! How did you do the logo?

I' m working up a home page in the Red, White & Blue theme...maybe I' ll try the Green too & see which one the hubbie likes better.

Thanks for the info on the links...they' re fixed now. I' m a moron...what can I say. [:D] Fixed the operating hours, too (supposed to be 3 am)[&:]




ardesigns -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/9/2002 2:53:31)

I agree totally with LindaK about the black background. When I started designed web sites I thought that black was cool, however I went to Internet World and spoke with Vincent Flanders and we had a discussion on black backgrounds. I have since changed my ways. I really like what LindaK came up with.

Angela
http://www.ardesigns.com



LindaK -> RE: Any help is greatly appreciated! (11/12/2002 19:23:51)

Rollerskate,
Please email me at llong@long2consulting.com and I will send you my photoshop and frontpage files. Really! I was just playing, but if you want them you can have them. They are too big to upload here! The zip is about 1 MB.

Linda[:D]



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